Comments on: Trades: The Twins' Most Beneficial Asset

By: David

David — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 19:13:11 +0000

we can stop with this nonsense and realize the only real strength from which we should trade is pitching.

Hey, you want someone on the team with perahps an inflated worth? How about trading Scott Baker?

I found these two comments amusing coming in the same comment, given that Scott Baker is the best pitcher in the Twins organization outside of Joe Nathan. I’m also curious as to why you think he has “inflated worth,” or what you mean by that. Do you mean that he’s not as valuable as people make him out to be? Because last year he was a 3.5 win pitcher at $750,000 – that’s pretty darn valuable. Or, do you mean that he, like Kubel, provides exceedingly high value in terms of wins per dollar, and therefore could command a huge return? If that’s your point, then I have a hard time understanding how the idea of trading Kubel is “nonsense” given that you base trading Baker on the very same premise. But you’d at least be right about Baker – he does, like Kubel, offer extremely high value in terms of wins per dollar. The only problem with trading him is the other consideration – whether the player is expendable and can be easily replaced. Whereas Kubel could be replaced by improved outfield defense (see: Gomez, Carlos playing everyday in center) and a Morneau/Cuddyer platoon at first/DH, there is no obvious replacement for an organization’s far-and-away best starting pitcher, with no immediate replacement in sight.

Your Kubel trade is pretty much nonsense; it’s totally unnecessary. You want J.J. Hardy? Trade a package of pitching and Alexi Casilla.

You’ll notice that I didn’t actually formulate a concrete trade proposal for Kubel, like saying he’d have to be part of a JJ Hardy trade; not sure if you were talking to me or the commenter above. For the record, I don’t see Kubel being part of a Hardy trade – Hardy shouldn’t command that much, and the Brewers probably wouldn’t want a DH who plays pretty terrible defense. Just for the record, I was merely pointing out that Kubel would be a legitimate trade chip if the Twins want to make a blockbuster deal and address multiple weaknesses with one trade. You’ll notice I said, “This isn’t to say, “TRADE KUBEL!!!” Trading any player requires weighing that player’s value against the value received in return. This is only to say that trading Kubel might be the Twins’ best opportunity at improving via trade.” Oh, and it’s pretty well accepted that Alexi Casilla was one of the worst players in baseball last year. I don’t see him being a key part of any trade, given that he’s just as likely to be a liability as an asset, and for his career is 1 win below replacement level. He might be a throw-in, sure, but nothing more.

By: Lala72

Lala72 — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 05:38:53 +0000

…Or, we can stop with this nonsense and realize the only real strength from which we should trade is pitching. Everyone wants pitching, including the Brewers. And, we can’t keep all these guys on the brink year after year, just watching them get older and depreciate in value. Time to start moving guys like Perkins, Manship, Swarzak, Robertson, and the likes. Assets are worth nothing unless they have value on the trade market. Time to start moving out some of the congestion in this system for pieces that fill gaping holes.

And, really, the Twins revenues topped $190M this year. This is by no means a poor team or a “small market.” Time to start coughing up some dough to fill a few holes.

Your Kubel trade is pretty much nonsense; it’s totally unnecessary. You want J.J. Hardy? Trade a package of pitching and Alexi Casilla.

Hey, you want someone on the team with perahps an inflated worth? How about trading Scott Baker?

By: Offseason Outlook: Third Base | Twins Fix

Offseason Outlook: Third Base | Twins Fix — Thu, 29 Oct 2009 03:06:21 +0000

[...] Trades: The Twins’ Most Beneficial Asset [...]

By: Heineken-77

Heineken-77 — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 04:26:26 +0000

Bowie.. I like the idea of trading Casilla. Maybe package him with Perkins and a prospect and ship him for J.J. Hardy. I don’t think you can just give up on Young yet. When we got him, most of us knew that it was going to be a couple years to see where Delmon ends up. He’s the youngest player on our team and he shows plenty upside still. Give him a year in Target Field. I don’t think we should have Guerrier closing games for the Twins though.

By: Bowie

Bowie — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 22:10:41 +0000

I don’t agree with trading Kubel — he is a player who’s demonstrated that he’s on the upswing and we risk giving away more upside than we get in return. I’d rather trade Nathan who appears to be trending downward, Young who has upside, but doesn’t know how to work a pitcher, and Casilla, who will never win Gardy’s confidence. Make Guerrier the closer, pick up a 3B and solid middle infielder.

By: Heineken-77

Heineken-77 — Fri, 23 Oct 2009 18:45:44 +0000

Interesting post. We don’t want to hear it, but it is true, Jason Kubel is our best trade-bait that we can afford to lose while pulling in the most back from another team. It makes our outfield defense stronger by putting gomez at cf and span in a corner spot-those two alone might be all you need, jk. This will also give Delmon Young everyday at bats which he needs. I think delmons defense will improve away from the dome as well, or at least i hope. Cuddyer and Morneau splitting dh and 1st makes up for kubel, argubably. I do think that the Twins should only trade him if he’s apart of a blockbuster deal bringing in an Ace. Kubel for J.J. Hardy or someone to that is interesting, but I believe Kubels trade value should be able to be the main center piece to a bigger type deal, for an Ace. A team looking to shed away some salary, via an Ace, would have to consider trading him for Kubel and his small 2-year salary. —- Your next piece could be on some potential teams that would take a look at trading for Kubel????

By: David

David — Fri, 23 Oct 2009 13:25:05 +0000

That is a good point, but what I’m talking about is making an improvement via trade in terms of what you could get back. To me, precisely because Kubel’s contract is so good (and therefore shedding it wouldn’t give much payroll flexibility), he would give the Twins the best return, possibly in terms of excellent young, high value talent. Morneau would help our payroll flexibility, but he wouldn’t bring back as much talent precisely because another team would be taking a hit on their own payroll flexibility. Same thing with Cuddyer, only difference being that he doesn’t handicap the payroll as much while being an inferior hitter to Morneau.

By: doofus

doofus — Fri, 23 Oct 2009 12:32:34 +0000

the fallacy of your argument is that trading him doesn’t clear much payroll flexibility as we only save 5 million ler season. Cuddyer is the better trade candidate from a payroll perspective. Or If you look furhter into your own debate Morneau would also be a good trade candidate and Cuddyer can move to first.